A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

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paul.mercer
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A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by paul.mercer »

Gentlemen,
In his excellent reply to my query about Bismarcks poor shooting in the final battle Wadinga wrote:
The gale force winds and heavy seas made gunnery conditions for the British ships extremely difficult, limiting the number of hits even at short ranges, and they could manoeuvre to minimise weather effects on their motion. The Bismarck that faced her pursuers that morning was a shadow of the ship she had been several days earlier and was incapable of serious resistance.
In calm weather, with her motion less violent, who can tell what might have occurred?

I'm not sure if this scenario has been discussed before, but let us suppose Bismarck's rudder had not been damaged so she could still maneuver, but she had taken a serious torpedo hit which stopped her for a while then severely limited her top speed to around 20-23 knots bringing her into a similar speed range as Rodney but obviously a lot slower than KGV but allowing them to catch up.
So we have a slower but still very capable of maneuvering Bismarck v KGV & Rodney, would the eventual outcome still be the same but with both RN ships suffering damage?
Steve Crandell
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by Steve Crandell »

I think you still have the exhaustion factor in favor of the British. Anything can happen with battleship caliber shells flying around, but I think it's extremely unlikely the outcome would have been different.
Francis Marliere
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by Francis Marliere »

If Bismarck is still able to steer, I guess that she would run away, and proceed at best speed toward a French port. Rodney would probably be incapable to catch her. The German have nothing to gain in a confrontation with a superior enemy force. Strictly my opinion, of course.

Francis
paul.mercer
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by paul.mercer »

Hi Francis,
Yes, you are probably correct, but I was basing the hypothetical scenario where Bismarck had been stopped for long enough to allow the two RN ships to catch up, but by then Bismarck had overcome some of the problems caused by the torpedo hit and was then capable of going at 20-23 knots maximum, which meant she would be unlikely to be able to get away once KGV & Rodney had caught up with her, but although her speed was limited she could still maneuver and fight using all her guns. I suspect the outcome would have been the same in the end, but at what cost to the RN ships?
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by Steve Crandell »

If they had to maintain that speed during the battle would they have run out of fuel on the way home?
Thorsten Wahl
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by Thorsten Wahl »

in this case the destroyer battle the night before likely would be much mor intense.
Meine Herren, es kann ein siebenjähriger, es kann ein dreißigjähriger Krieg werden – und wehe dem, der zuerst die Lunte in das Pulverfaß schleudert!
paul.mercer
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by paul.mercer »

Steve Crandell wrote: Fri Oct 02, 2020 3:21 pm If they had to maintain that speed during the battle would they have run out of fuel on the way home?
That's a very good point Steve, I hadn't considered that one, do you think that in my scenario there was a hope in hell that Bismarck would survive?
Steve Crandell
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by Steve Crandell »

paul.mercer wrote: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:33 pm
Steve Crandell wrote: Fri Oct 02, 2020 3:21 pm If they had to maintain that speed during the battle would they have run out of fuel on the way home?
That's a very good point Steve, I hadn't considered that one, do you think that in my scenario there was a hope in hell that Bismarck would survive?
I don't think the odds are very good. The British would probably resort to towing Rodney home before they gave up sinking Bismarck. Also, Ark Royal is lurking over the horizon waiting for her chance at the target.
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José M. Rico
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Re: A slower but fully capable Bismarck in the final battle

Post by José M. Rico »

paul.mercer wrote: Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:47 am Hi Francis,
Yes, you are probably correct, but I was basing the hypothetical scenario where Bismarck had been stopped for long enough to allow the two RN ships to catch up, but by then Bismarck had overcome some of the problems caused by the torpedo hit and was then capable of going at 20-23 knots maximum, which meant she would be unlikely to be able to get away once KGV & Rodney had caught up with her, but although her speed was limited she could still maneuver and fight using all her guns. I suspect the outcome would have been the same in the end, but at what cost to the RN ships?
It's still a 1 vs. 2 (+ Norfolk, Dorsetshire and a dozen Swordfish).
Bismarck might have obtained some hits and It would probably have taken longer to put all her guns out of action, but the outcome would have been the same.
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