Monitors

From the Washington Naval Treaty to the end of the Second World War.
paul.mercer
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Monitors

Post by paul.mercer » Thu Apr 16, 2020 11:33 am

Gentlemen,
Have been having a look at some of the RN Monitors on line, it seems that the turret was mounted quite high on a form of' trunking' presumably to increase the range, but I wonder how vulnerable that trunking would be from incoming shore fire, particularly as it would have has its cordite and shells coming up through it.
Also, looking at one of the last survivors 'Roberts' which apparently traveled to Italy for bombardment purposes had a top speed of about 13/14 knots -(and that was when she was new!) Presumably to enable her to get there on time she must have set out some weeks before the rest of the invasion fleet! Its a bit surprising that she was sent out at all, bearing in mind that there seems to be a surplus of old battleships available to do the job.

OpanaPointer
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Re: Monitors

Post by OpanaPointer » Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:43 pm

USN barbettes were routinely armored.

paul.mercer
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Re: Monitors

Post by paul.mercer » Fri Apr 17, 2020 9:24 am

Presumably the RN Monitor barbettes were also armoured, but surely with that amount of trunking exposed any it would be likely to either destroy or disrupt the ammunition hoists?
also,as i said before it's surprising that the RN took such an old and slow ship all the way to Italy when there were several old battleships with six more guns that could have done the bombarding.

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Fri Apr 17, 2020 11:39 pm

In the 15" monitors the barbettes were 8" thick, not as thick as in a battleship, but as they were not intended to fight an enemy battleship that seems quiet good. A monitor chooses from where to fire, surely she would not close to a shore defended by a 15" coastal gun.

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Fri Apr 17, 2020 11:43 pm

The height of the turrets, as far as I know, was dictated by the shallow draft, the mountings were about the same as fitted to the 15" battleships, a shallower hull meant that some of the mounting would protude above upper deck.

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wadinga
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Re: Monitors

Post by wadinga » Sat Apr 18, 2020 9:42 am

Hello Marcelo,

A very clever piece of deduction- wish I'd thought of that myself :clap: :clap: :clap:

The heavily bulged monitors could "hang about" in the area of land operations providing fire support over time and perhaps survive mine and torpedo attacks more valuable vessels couldn't. Several pre-dreadnoughts with large crews were sunk while supporting the Gallipoli operations, and future Grand Fleet flagship Queen Elizabeth and battle cruiser Inflexible were also damaged, the latter needed to be beached to survive.

As has been observed, purpose built monitors had shallow draft allowing them to get into firing locations where deep draft battleships could not go. The last RN variety built might be considered the Landing Craft Gun which were were equipped with ex destroyer 4.7"s and pom-poms and designed to allow point-blank beach head fire support. The Omaha debacle, saved by destroyers which nearly ran aground while firing at pillboxes, might have been less costly, if some LCGs had been available. (And fire support radios had worked).

All the best in troubled times

wadinga
"There seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Sat Apr 18, 2020 3:43 pm

Thanks Wadinga!

Byron Angel
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Re: Monitors

Post by Byron Angel » Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:25 pm

Marcelo,
If you want to dig deeper on this subject, get a hold of the book "Big Gun Monitors" by Ian Buxton.

Byron

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Sat Apr 18, 2020 11:05 pm

Yes Byron, I know the book and have it in my wish list, mostly because it is highly recommended.

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paul.mercer
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Re: Monitors

Post by paul.mercer » Sun Apr 19, 2020 9:20 am

Thanks gentlemen,
I believe that on RN monitor had an 18" gun that was originally designed to go on HMS Furious and there was another which went on some sort of rail gun, so it seems that the RN were experimenting with very large calibre guns before WW2, but presumably it would take a ship somewhere in the region of the size of an Yamato to mount several of them.
Had it not been for the rise of the aircraft carrier who knows what size of gun and what size of battleship would have been designed by the various nations!

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Re: Monitors

Post by Byron Angel » Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:00 pm

Guns of 20-inch bore were being discussed with straight faces in the post-WW1 period IIRC.

B

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Mon Apr 20, 2020 4:34 pm

Byron, what do you mean for straight faces?

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Byron Angel
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Re: Monitors

Post by Byron Angel » Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:17 pm

marcelo_malara wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 4:34 pm
Byron, what do you mean for straight faces?

My apologies, Marcelo.

The phrase "with a straight face" is an English language slang expression (colloquialism) meaning that the speaker or writer was not making a joke, even though the subject of discussion might at first seem ridiculous.

Example: "How can you say that with a straight face???"

Byron

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marcelo_malara
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Re: Monitors

Post by marcelo_malara » Mon Apr 20, 2020 11:14 pm

No problem Byron, we always learn something :D ! I imagined that you meant smooth bore!

Byron Angel
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Re: Monitors

Post by Byron Angel » Tue Apr 21, 2020 5:19 pm

marcelo_malara wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 11:14 pm
No problem Byron, we always learn something :D ! I imagined that you meant smooth bore!
Marcelo, I understand that every language has such expressions ... so I may one day have need to consult you!

BTW, speaking of 20-inch smoothbore cannons, the USA actually manufactured two such guns at the end of the American Civil War. Both guns still exist. Go here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodman_gun

BRgds / Byron

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