Their only advantage was that they were so strange looking, that they could be disguised as a building in the middle of the sea!!!
Or that just possibly, a Hilfskruezer would mistake Nelson for an Oiler and close in to force her to heave to.................imagine the surprise when the Germans see a a salvo of 16" shells leave the forecastle
God created the world in 6 days.........and on the 7th day he built the Scharnhorst
I agree that the formula you using can be a helping hand, but in reality it lookes a little bit different. I think the armor factor must be counted, it has a vital part in how powerfull a battleship is. For example i have a much bigger trust in Vanguard outside your list than Hood thats for sure!! Maybe a formula with the average armourthickness x % of the ship covered with armour can be the armour factor.
For example i have a much bigger trust in Vanguard outside your list than Hood thats for sure!!
I didn´t considered Vanguard in my list, you´re right. If we considered it then maybe it will go up in the list. This weekend I´ll look for her specifications in order to put her inside the Top Ten.
Marcelo:
I´m just averaging the first list I posted here with yours. To the first place of each list I give it 10 points and substract 0.25 points while going down, so second place takes a 9,75 and third 9,50 and so on. Then I add the result of one list to the another and average it. That´s all.
What do you think about HMS Vanguard?
Best regards
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. Sir Winston Churchill
Oops! Just remember the reason why Vanguard never got into the list: she is not part of the WWII fleet. She was commisioned in 1946 and never fired her guns in anger. So, we cannot put her with other vessels that saw action in the war. But her data is here:
Displacement: 48,500 tons
Length: 814 ft 6" (246.8 metres)
Beam: 107 ft 7in (32.8 metres)
Draught: 30 ft 6 in (9.3 metres)
Propulsion: 8 Admiralty 3-drum water-tube boilers (400 psi, 750°F), 4 Parsons single reduction steam turbines, 4 shafts, 130,000 shp (97 MW)
Speed: 30 knots
Range: 9000 nautical miles (17 000 km) at 20 knots (37 km/h)
Complement: 1500
Armament: 8 x BL 15 in /42(38 cm) guns in four twin mountings Mark IN with RP12 RPC
16 x QF 5.25 in /50 (13.3 cm) guns in 8 twin mountings Mark I* with RP10 RPC
54 x 40 mm /60 Bofors AA guns in sextuple mounting Mark VI with RP50 RPC
2 x 40 mm /60 Bofors AA guns in twin mounting STAAG Mark I
11 x 40 mm /60 Bofors AA guns in single mountings Mark VII
4 x QF 3 pdr (47 mm) saluting
Electronics: 1 x Radar Type 960 air warning
1 x Radar Type 293 target indication
1 x Radar Type 277 height finding
2 x Radar Type 274 15 inch fire control
4 x Radar Type 275 5.25 inch fire control
10 x Radar Type 262 40 mm fire control
Motto: We Lead
A thought: indeed, the Radar Directed Fire Control would had done incredible damage if Vanguard had the oportunity to fight another BB. But her guns were only 15"/L42. In comparison Bismarck had L47 or the Iowas have their L50. Without her RDFC she´ll be in disadvantage with, at least, the Top 6 (15" or + ) of the Battleships that saw action in WWII. Just for the record.
Because her late commisioning she is not going inside the Top lists.
Best regards
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. Sir Winston Churchill
Tirpitz never fired her bug guns on another ship either
Don´t misunderstand me please, Gary, the problem is that Vanguard was commisioned after the war ended. If she was commisioned May 7th, 1945 we will have to include her in a WWII Top Ten. But to be fair we must exclude it. And is a shame because she was a great ship.
What do you think about my comment about her L42 main guns?
Best regards.
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. Sir Winston Churchill
Gun length alone is not much help. Bismarck's guns had 9% more muzzle energy than Vanguard's...sometimes! Vanguard had a choice of propellants, which meant that sometimes Bismarck would have only 94.5% as much muzzle energy. And then there will be more variation depending on the erosion of the barrels.
You just end up adapting the formula until it gives you a result you more or less accepted, so you're just as well off without it. With only 10 ships, you can put them in any order you want.
After all these days I believe that everybody more or less agrees on how the lists were made. So, to have them in order I post them again, with all the corrections suggested:
I. Top Ten Most Famous WWII BBs and BCs
1. Bismarck
2. Hood
3. Arizona
4. Schanhorst
5. Missouri
6. Royal Oak
7. PoW
8. Repulse
9. Yamato
10. Tirpitz
Note: The only one that survived afloat: Missouri.
II. Top Ten Most Beautifull WWII BBs and BCs
1. Bismarck
2. HMS Hood
3. Schanhorst
4. HMS KGV
5. HMS Warspite
6. HMS Repulse
7. Richelieu
8. Vittorio Veneto
9. Yamato
10. Royal Oak
III. Top Ten Most Powerfull WWII BBs and BCs
1.Yamato Class and Iowa Class
2. South Dakota Class
3. North Carolina Class
4. Richelieu
5. Bismarck Class
6. Nelson Class
7. Nagato Class
8. Littorio Class
9. KGV Class
10. HMS Hood
Special Mention:
HMS Vanguard (post WWII BB)
Most Ugly WWII BB:
Gangut
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. Sir Winston Churchill
