Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Historical what if discussions, hypothetical operations, battleship vs. battleship engagements, design your own warship, etc.
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miro777
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Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Post by miro777 »

hey....

Dunkerque vs Scharnhorst....


who would win? and why?


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Tiornu
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Re: Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Post by Tiornu »

Mulligan has pointed out that the Germans didn't think they had something that would beat Dunkerque until they completed Bismarck.
Dunkerque's main battery was not as efficient as the designers intended, and the dispersion was excessive. If the Germans can outshoot the French, they have a reasonable hope for victory.
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Post by miro777 »

hey...
wouldn't the decision to put all the armament into 2 quadruple guns forward way as an disadvantage to the French side??


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Post by Tiornu »

Not really. It means all the guns are in close proximity to the forward superstructure which is likely to be the German point of aim. Not very important.
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Gary
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Post by Gary »

Scharnhorst is better armoured
God created the world in 6 days.........and on the 7th day he built the Scharnhorst
ostriker
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Re: Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Post by ostriker »

Tiornu wrote: Dunkerque's main battery was not as efficient as the designers intended, and the dispersion was excessive. If the Germans can outshoot the French, they have a reasonable hope for victory.
Yes of curse, but it was when Dunkerque was firing at a target 40 Km away.

At Mers el kébir, the Strasbourg fired 3 salvoes and escaped.
The third straddled the Hood.

In this same action a 15 inch shell hit the top of the Dunkerque turret B. Only one half (as intended by the designer) was put of action.

No i think that the a fight between Gneisenau and Dunkerque, each one has her chance to win. Dunkerque 50% - 50% Gneisenau
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Re: Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Post by Tiornu »

At extreme ranges, dispersion can actually start to decrease.
It's easy to straddle with a large pattern.
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ontheslipway
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Post by ontheslipway »

Err, are you sure?
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Post by Tiornu »

Some causes of dispersion are minimized as the gun elevation nears 45deg. The range difference between guns firing at (for example) 45deg and 42deg will be smaller than that for guns fired at 25deg and 22deg. In each case, the difference is 3deg, but 3deg means less at great range.
In any case, if dispersion is excessive at one elevation, it is not likely to be less excessive at another elevation. Excessive is excessive.
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Post by ontheslipway »

Oh, dispersion in range, I see, not in bearing.
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Post by Tiornu »

No, I don't know of any ships cited for problems with dispersion bearing. I suspect that guns with high velocity would have less bearing dispersion anyway.
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Re: Dunkerque vs. Scharnhorst

Post by RF »

ostriker wrote:At Mers el kébir, the Strasbourg fired 3 salvoes and escaped. The third straddled the Hood.
I wasn't aware of that. This does pose an interesting scenario.... see my new topic....
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Post by miro777 »

hey....


wasn't the Scharnhorst class designed to resist the Dunkerques?

so why would the Germans build a ship less likely to win?

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Post by Tiornu »

Politics. The limitations imposed by Germany's newly awakened warship production. Things like that.
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Post by miro777 »

hey....
what do u mean by that?

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