Graf Spee vs. Cumberland

[Bgile]

Marcelo,

I wasn't thinking of vertical or near vertical fire, but a below decks detonation that blows a hole in the ships bottom.

Bgile,

At the River Plate battle the AGS opened fire at its maximum range and Exeter had to hold fire for about three minutes until it was in range.
If spotting is a problem the Germans had a seaplane for the job.

I don't know where you got your info, but I don't think AGS opened fire at over 38,000 yds, which was the approximate range of her guns.

NAVWEAPS lists the British 8" cruiser gun with a range of 30,650 yds. That is longer than practicable with FC of the day. I don't know why Exeter waited 3 min to fire, but it wasn't the gun range. Maybe it took that long for her to get a good FC solution. In any case, 3 min wouldn't represent a significant difference in range. At 29,000 yds it took an 8" shell 78.2 seconds to reach the target.

British cruisers had aircraft also.

[marcelo_malara]

I wasn't thinking of vertical or near vertical fire, but a below decks detonation that blows a hole in the ships bottom.

Did this ever happen to any warship?

[RF]

I don't know the precise ranges fire was opened. The sources for my information were taken from Millington-Drake's compilation.

I am not aware of internal shell explosions causing the bottom of a ship to be holed, apart from the scale of catastrophic explosion that destroyed Hood. But ships being sunk by long range fire were rare - there were few opportunities on a ship vs. ship basis.

[lwd]

tactically I think GS probably has an edge but strategically she doesn't. Odds are she would have to use up a large portion of her 11" ammo on Cumberland and even so may not sink her without resorting to torpedos. In return there is a good chance that Spee will take enough damage that her chance of returning home is almost nil. From at least one account I've read of the River Platt battle Spee's shooting (at least with her main battery) was very good. A lot would depend on whether or not her shooting was as good in this engagment. I thought the account of the River Platt battle at:
http://www.bobhenneman.info/bhbrp.htm
Was very good. Note that it has Spee opening fire at 20,000 yards. Also mentions scoreing 3 hits in first 8 salvos with 2 more soon after.

[Bgile]

AGS probably had a much better fire control system overall. She could definitely sink Cumberland, but the problem is she could take damage in return which would make it impossible for her to get home.