Hello everybody,
@ Wadinga,
Sean, here following something for you to realize better the overall situation we are evaluating for the HMS Norfolk.
Of course it is in a very small scale from the Plan 3 with a lot of tolerances to be better tuned, ... but in this way you and everybody else should be in condition to definitively realize what we are talking about.
I have placed on the map several measure references, so the reasoning should be facilitated for everybody.
- Norfolk_Plan_3_0100_0800_06.jpg (94.33 KiB) Viewed 1345 times
NOTE :
1) The track of Norfolk is pretty well defined on Plan 3 as well as on her own Strategical map, including the turn away until 03.20.
2) Norfolk 05.41 position having the enemy at 276°, the Suffolk at 318-320°, using the " Polygon " of PoW plan 4 is defined too.
3) Norfolk 02.56 position is defined either by following her own track backwards from 05.41, ... or by going down from 01.00 until 02.56.
What is key to realize on that 02.29-02.56 timeframe is that Norfolk had the PoW at 02.29 at around 8 sea miles at 298° (
) from her while on course 220° ( see map above ), ... while PoW got Norfolk by RD/F radio on true bearing 68° (
) while tramsitting the 02.29 msg to Suffolk ... with general visibility being just 1 sea mile ( ref. Suffolk msg at 02.30 am ).
Norfolk got PoW once again at 02.55 while still sailing a 220° course, ... and I am assuming also at around 5 to 8 sea miles from her still on her starboard bow straight ahead more or less, ... but no information about bearing and distance were provided this time from the Norfolk.
Why I assume this ? Very simple, ... since her Type 286 M radar can reach that visibility limit of max 8 sea miles only ( 10.000 yards usual range = 5 sea/nautical miles ) just as Dave Saxton explained us :
... Type 286M had a fixed antenna.
It only saw in the general direction the Norfolk was going, although the beam was about 45* wide.
Its typical range to a surface ship was about 10,000 yards.
more :
Type 286 M radar -> Metric target indication set based upon RAF ASV (Air to Surface Vessel) Mark II set. Type 286M had fixed antennas, with a central Tx and an Rx on either side to give some indication of contact bearing. The antennas were fixed, scanning being achieved by conning the ship.
from here :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_W ... aval_radar
and ...
Type 286 M radar -> Sea trials indicated that the set could detect a cruiser at six to eight miles, a destroyer from four to seven miles, and a trimmed down submarine at one to one and a half miles. Range accuracy was 200 yards between 1,000 and 20,000 yards. Under actual operating conditions, a trimmed down submarine could only be detected under the most optimum of conditions.
from here :
http://jproc.ca/sari/sarrad2.html
and here :
The Type 286 was a British naval air search radar, derived from the ASV Mark I and available from shortly after the Allied evacuation from Dunkirk in France. It was the first destroyer set, designed for small ships, and was very crude, having no rotating antenna. The target area was scanned by maneuvering the ship. Range = 8 nautical miles (15 km) on cruiser
http://pwencycl.kgbudge.com/T/y/Type_286_radar.htm
Consequently with visibility on the area on that moment reduced at 1 sea mile as for Suffolk information at 02.30 ... I doubt it was a visual spot the one made by Norfolk from 8 sea miles at 02.29 ... and I am assuming Norfolk could have taken the PoW just with her own radar Type 286 M ( not confirmed on her own radio messages at 02.29 and 02.55 ) spotting her at the maximum limit ... so at around 8 sea/nautical miles ...
Opinions on the 02.29 and 02.55 Norfolk to PoW close contacts ( both ways ) are welcome ...
Bye Antonio
In order to honor a soldier, we have to tell the truth about what happened over there. The whole, hard, cold truth. And until we do that, we dishonor her and every soldier who died, who gave their life for their country. ( Courage Under Fire )