alecsandros wrote:Hi Karl,
I guess South Dakota is so over rated because of G&D book. Allthough they pointed several problems, overall they named the class "best treaty batleship" or something like that, and in other places mentioned they were "much better than larger and more expensive designs of other countries".
What I've seen on other forums is a wide debate over USS Massachussets (a South Dakota class ship) during the battle of Casablanca, 1942.
People get easily enthusiastic about claims of destroyers sunk at 27km distance by 16" gunfire, and by the 25km hits obtained on Jean Bart.
While my opinion is that Massachussets performed formidably well that day, there is no way I'm buying all those "beliefs" about the way the battle was fought that day.
Recent studies indicate that the 2 destroyers sunk by gunfire were hit by 2 US heavy cruisers, while Massachussets obtained near-misses on them, but the range is unknown.
Jean Bart, or Jim Bean how I like to call her, was hit at 20-22km distance by 5 x 16" AP superheavy shells.
..... Before someone pops up to breathlessly point out that JEAN BART was helplessly moored to a dock at the time she was under fire by MASSACHUSETTS, it is necessary to also point out that JEAN BART was not visible to MASSACHUSETTS for almost the entire time of the bombardment due to intervening smoke screens and smoke from fires burning in the surrounding port facility. In addition, JEAN BART's end-on aspect to the line of fire of MASSACHUSETTS made her a very difficult target in deflection, despite the fact that she was motionless. MASSACHUSETTS essentially was conducting blind/indirect fire under the control of a spotter aircraft while underway and also maneuvering to evade fire from El Hank battery.
Apart from JEAN BART, Vincent O'Hara's article in Warship 2011 - 'The Battle of Casasblanca" The Marine Nationale versus the U.S. Navy" - relates the following with respect to the gunnery of MASSACHUSETTS against other targets -
0736 hrs - passenger ship PORTHOS (at dock) hit by 16in shell and capsized.
0752 hrs - passenger ship SAVOIE hit by two 16in shells.
0758 hrs - passenger ship IL d'OUESSANT hit by two 16in shells and capsized.
0800 hrs - merchant vessel FAUZON hit by 16in shell.
0800+ hrs - MALIN (at dock) hit by 16in dud in No. 2 boiler room.
0810 hrs - ILE de NIRMOUTIER hit by 16in shell.
0815 hrs - merchant vessel FAUZON hit by 16in shell.
0940 hrs - destroyer FOUGUEUX hit by 16in shell.
1000- hrs - destroyer MILAN hit by three 16in shells
O'Hara, in his summary, also credits a hit upon PRIMAGUET, but appears to give no details in the text (or else I missed it in my quick reading).
This was accomplished by a rookie ship in her first action, without the aid of FC radar (both out for various reasons) under very difficult visual conditions (extensive French use of smoke screens plus drifting smoke from land fires) against aggressively maneuvering light forces, while under fire from coastal batteries.
I recommend Mr O'Hara's article as worth a read - well researched and IMO quite objective.
B