Naval History Forums

It´s still a remarkable performance - 0.98 cal penetration* CA at 30 deg obliquity and 476 m/s. Similar performance of the 38cm L4.4 APC was 0.9 cal KC at 30 deg and 500 m/s (altough the definition here was different requiring the projectile to either completely penetrate in a broken condition or to...

J. Sitz goes into some details in this question in his article for the Lilienthal-papers (p.109-113). The PzGr.39 had the aility to penetrate almost any thickness RHA armour in a condition fit to burst, provided that the velocity was high enough and shatter didn´t set in. In one case, he cites a tri...

The notes on the data mention that the plate was 70* errect. Obviously it could not be tilted the one way such that the total obliquity was very little. It appears to be set up so as simulate the effect of a sloped belt. I personally think that the 20* slope implied was propbably simply a mistaken ...

Dear Dunmunro, thanks to You for pointing me to these valuable cross country trials. I have compiled them in the chart below and would have put the perforartion limit exactly where the RN investigators put it, at 1370fps: http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/9625/rntirpitztests2.jpg Additionally, I have...

@ mostlyharmless: thanks. I think this deletes the differences in Facehd v. 6.8 and penetration of british CA. In the case of the TIRPITZ plates the things are different. 12.172" correspond to either a 486.88lbs (1"=40lbs) plate or 496,617lbs (using 1"=40.8lbs). This convinces me that...

I share Byron´s perspective in this.

If You have contact with mr. Saxton, can You ask him to explain this and the relevant references to us?

thanks in advance,
delc

Excuse me for unearthing this rather old topic. Cross country armour trials are really hard to come across. This particulare one stroke me for the ability to cross check it with Facehd version 6.8 for accuracy. I suppose that the projectile used in these trials have been the non-cardonald, standart ...

I don´t do NAab calculations for a number of reasons. I was working on the official RMA penetration curves for 38cmL4.4 APC defeating KC n.A. published in the GKdos-100. My numbers come directly from these curves, not from a computing programm. The numbers for netto impact obliquity are done by trig...

But I suspect that these numbers are a bit in error:... . Where exactly do you see the error ? The phrase was "declined by 20* ", purposefully so that you wouldn't confuse it with INCLINED, which may have been interpreted as favoring perforation at long range, given that the compounded st...

Hipper was the best over commander at Jutland, and his command at Dogger Bank was good also. Only Beatty's poor decision led to Scheers escape at Dogger, but Beatty gung-ho attitude and poor communications ruined his chances at Dogger and Jutland. At Dogger, Scheer was not going to escape, he wasn´...

If I am not misunderstanding him, his reference to 0.93crh tip mentions the armour piercing cap which was welded with a solder to the projectile´s nose. He doesn´t mention that the projectile nose itselfe is a 0.93 crh design. But I suspect that these numbers are a bit in error: A 38cm L/4.4 fired f...

While there have been big difficulties in the BADEN trials to penetrate relatively thick armour (near calibre thick as in our cases with 15in APC striking 13.8in KC), there were relatively few difficulties to penetrate medium armour in these trials: 170mm /6.7in /0.45 cal plates for the 15in: [+] No...

The Baden Firing trials represent British 15” APC & CPC Shells vs. German circa-WWI KC armor. Specifically, I am referring to the limit case of 15” APC vs 13.75” of KC -- the limit case is about 1550-fps at about 25-30-degree obliquity. (...) The Bayern and Baden were sister ships. My point is ...

SCALING caused by to low %elongation as evidenced in GKdos-100 curves comparing 20.3cm and 38cm L4.4 APC for 0.5cal thick Wh plates is not -as previously believed- a constant factor depending on diameter and %elongation difference. We stumbled around this problem recently trying to verify Nathan Oku...

I on my part do appreciate and admire the work Mr. Okun is doing on the complex naval guns/armour interaction dynamics. But let me express my curiosity about these discrepiancies between primary sources and M79APCLC results. I understand that he is trying to expand upon M79APCLC to include different...