Naval History Forums

Bgile: the equipment of the US army was NOT second rate to anyone. The M10 and M36 Tank destroyers were most efficient and DID stop virtually all German armored counterattacks of 1944 and 1945. Especially the Panthers suffered from these tank killers. With their Tungsten armour piercing shot and ope...

Iwd Singapore, Bataan, and Wake for a start. And you DARE to compare those tiny insignificant places (at least Wake is!) with the huge Kessels of the Ostfront: Stalingrad 43, Minsk 44, Kishinev 44, Budapest 45, Heiligenbeil 45, Halbe 45 and Prague 45??? Each (except Budapest) with > 200.000 encircle...

IWD wrote I simplly can't believe this is correct. Indeed didn't the Soviets loose more men that the Germans in even the final battle for Berlin? Iwd, you really are a crack on naval warfare but about landwarfare you have to study more statistics AND analyze the which way battle losses in certain ci...

Boredatwork wrote: And (almost) always on the defensive. It's certainly alot easier to generate favorable kill ratios when you're hiding in a log bunker shooting at troops advancing in the open coming to you. They certainly didn't always perform that GREAT when attacking - for instance at Stalingrad...

mkenny wrote: The war was lost by 1943 and though there are those who claim the 1944-45 fighting 'proved' how good the Germans were you have to ask how could prolonging the war for an extra year (at least), getting about another 2 million of your citizens killed, your country totally destroyed, murd...

Ok Guys, it is on again. Karl must be respected because of his phenomenal knowledge of WWII, if he is pro German biased and if most of the others ar pro British or pro American biased: YES! I am Dutch so I have no particular sympathies. Have always stressed and underlined that the German Army endure...

Karl, Yes you are damn right to state that The EAST was so much gretaer than all what happened in The West: in north Arfriac the Germans lost 16.050 KIA in TWO years!!! In Moldavia in august 1944 they lost 16.000 KIA in ONE DAY and the day after that day another 16.000 KIA and that 6 days long!!! Bu...

Alecsandros. What you are trying to say is that a substantial part of the huge losses of the USSR can by blamed on either the NKVD or their ruthless way of attacking, using minorities in the first waves (and getting rid of them!), using Russians in the second wave and NKVD in the third......... Late...

Alecsandros, The Lend-lease gave the Soviets all the neccessary mobility, surplus of Aircraft, surplus tanks and communications equipment, jeeps, halftracks, trucks. And all of typically good sturdy quality........ So the Soviets could themselves concentrate on a few tank and aircraft designs, FLAK,...

Hi Karl: The book of Beevor was really shocking good (like that of Berlin). He is almost a surealistic "painter" of the War, quite different from the less prozaic Glantz (which is better in maps and the numbers). German casualties still seem not the be clear: - 6th army 20 + 1 FLAk divisio...

Bgile: according to the Survey 8420 USAAF fighters were lost over Europe and ME. Most against the Germans and few to the Italians I suppose. Of those 3014 against the Luftwaffe fighters and more than that number obviously to German Flak. IF the Luftwaffe lost 16.400 fihters it would be interesting t...

AAF losses: 9949 bombers and 8420 fighters in ETO and MTO RAF losses: 11965 bombers and 10045 fighters in ETO and MTO. Grand total: 40.379 to Flak and enemy aircraft (about 55%/45%). So Flak WAS quite effective and deadly. Imagine how many damaged bombers returned home.......... Not included 3500 ai...

Bgile: In the Luftwaffe boardgame (Avalon Hill) a booklet was enclosed with stats from the US Strategic bombardment Survey: Bomber - Fighter losses (to all causes?) over Europe per unit were: AAF 1st Tac 47- 313 8th AF 5945 - 3112 9th AF 804 - 2141 12th AF 773 - 1824 15th AF 2380 - 1030 RAF 2nd TAC ...

Bgile: ok this includes bombers AND fighters I suppose; and how many to enemy FLAK?

mkenny. It is indeed interesting to know the exact USAAF and RAF air losses over Europe due to Flak or enemy fighters. Since Russian losses are about 46.000 (to both Flak and Fighters) those of the Western Allies may be half of that in total? With Germans loosing about 17.000 fighters alone (not cou...